I actually have no idea what accurate Christianity is? I don't know what the Bible legitimately teaches... I'm still under the impression that the dead will be resurrected onto paradise earth? And that the soul doesn't go to heaven? And Jesus and God are two separate entities? Even though I'm awake to WT's corruption and don't subscribe to theism, I still have my JW blinders on when it comes to understanding what the scriptures say...
Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
JoinedPosts by Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
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22
Witnessing to two JW elders
by Roger Kirkpatrick ini was approached by two jehovah’s witness elders who handed me a pamphlet advertising the jw .org website.
each man carried a bible and an apple ipad.
they told me that they enjoyed visiting with people about the bible, and asked if i was a bible reader.
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Jehovah's Witnesses denial of what they are supposed to believe from Watchtower
by jambon1 inone of the most frustrating things.
when you confront jw's about what they believe they will often deny it.
such as "if your child is disfellowshipped then you can't have contact with them ever again".
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
It's always so frustrating when you have friends and family who are in and try to woo you back with what you KNOW to be deceptive reasoning! It's so jarring when they tell me "that's just your own opinion and you're wrong about that" when I counter them with facts about the society and what it teaches! When I try to produce evidence (eg, older publications, recent publications, audio of the Gov Body, etc) they literally block their ears and close their eyes saying they don't want to know! HOW are these people in ANY position to actively try and recruit members when its to an organization they know SO LITTLE about?!
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Why "... when it does touch on scientific matters [the Bible] is accurate" is bogus BS.
by Island Man injws and other christians would often point to the handful of the bible verses that seem to be scientifically accurate as evidence of its divine inspiration.
but not surprisingly, they ignore the ones that are scientifically inaccurate, or when they address those verses they put a spin on it like saying the account is not a reflection of what the bible is teaching but what men at the time erroneously believed and which god allowed them to record in the bible.
would you believe a jw actually told me that!
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
When I was younger and doing my Bible reading with my father, he'd marvel at the "inspiration" of Job and Isiah and rave about the water cycle and other mundane observations. When I'd point out that the earth does not have "foundations", "four corners" or a heaven stretched just above us, he'd say, "this is of course POETIC language," and he'd whisk me over to Revelation where such apocalyptic (otherwise poetic) language is used in conjunction with such flat-earth descriptions. He'd reason that since the visions are by no means literal, why would the flat earth language in the same verses be taken literally as well? It's all just symbolic.
Why he got to cherry pick which verses CAN be taken as literal and why others may not is yet to be revealed to me. Maybe I'll have a vision tonight with all the answers unveiled. Or a demonic attack (pseudo-seizure) whereby the answers are given to me from the other side. Or perhaps the earth will split open and swallow up my doubt (you know... like an earthquake). But hey, if that's blasphemy, I know I'll be plagued by a disease caused by a displeased God... not microorganisms.
Seriously, if this above reasoning doesn't sound like wisdom from a gang of bronze age goat herders, I don't know WHAT has credibility anymore.
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The little things that made you feel guilty as a JW?
by HereIgo inwatching rated r movies?
maybe a little gambling in vegas?
when i was in high school i went to the mall with my friend at the time, who happened to be a female.
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
When I lost my virginity to a married regular pioneer brother who told me, after eleven months straight of riding the train into work together every morning, that he was in love with me and was miserable in his eight year marriage. That he was planning to get disfellowshipped for me and divorce his wife and be with the true love of his life: me. I was 21 at the time, inactive for nearly two years and a firm believer in evolution. Yet my years of indoctrination haunted me and affected me so deeply that, once the deed was done, I set out on a course of self destruction. Drugs to numb the pain of what I'd done. A revolving door of partners to try and "wipe out" the memory of losing my virginity before marriage. I was determined to punish myself severely for having sex before marriage. And with someone who was married. I still carry around that sadness for what I'd done. Last I heard, all these years later, is that the brother and his wife are still "happily" married and pioneering together and were interviewed on stage at a convention. Fortunately for the husband, I disappeared from his life after the deed, changed my number, changed my trains that I caught into work and finally responded to his myriad of emails begging to see me again because he was so "in love with me" telling him I could never see or talk to him again. I don't know how he continues to live his facade, but I know for me... it's something I've never truly forgiven myself for.
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The Resurrection narrative can make perfect sense if you consider it to be a lie.
by Island Man inthere are aspects to the resurrection story that seem unnecessary but make perfect sense if you consider them as patches to shore up the lie of jesus' resurrection.. (1) why did there have to be angels present at jesus' resurrection?
there is no other resurrection account in the bible that mentions the involvement of angels.. possible explanation: jesus' disciples really did steal jesus' body from the tomb.
two or three of them ambushed and knocked/drugged unconscious the guards on the scene before stealing the body.
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
Jesus 2.0 (ie the unrecognizable dude) was the prophetic antitype for revised Watchtower literature millennia later. Ask Freddy Franz. Ya see? Even the gospels reveal that things would be vague, rewritten and unrecognizable in a 20th century religion.
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The god of love and his most loving son Jesus Christ
by Crazyguy inso their the very essence of love so we are taught so then why at luke 14:26 jesus says in order to be his follower you must hate your mother, father, wife, brothers and sisters.
then you must renounce everything you have.
wow just plain wow, and they call me crazy!
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
@EverApostate: "Kill those who stumble His worshipers"... anyone got a rope for the Governing Body?
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The god of love and his most loving son Jesus Christ
by Crazyguy inso their the very essence of love so we are taught so then why at luke 14:26 jesus says in order to be his follower you must hate your mother, father, wife, brothers and sisters.
then you must renounce everything you have.
wow just plain wow, and they call me crazy!
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
Yes, God loves even unborn babies and equates abortion to murder. But is happy to have live babies murdered for being born to the wrong parents. There's a reason why we don't run into any Amalekites these days.
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Why is the approval of family so important?
by jwfacts inone of the reasons people remain pimo is fear of losing family.
those that are disfellowshipped and shunned regularly comment about how devastated that they have lost the approval of their parents.. when i respond to emails from people saying how difficult it is being estranged or looked down on by their parents, i would like to say that over time they will come to terms with it, except i not sure that people ever do.
i cannot shake that feeling either.
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
Thank you, jp1692. Once again, well put.
May I ask, do a lot of the ex-Witnesses you encounter seem to be genuine, sincere people with big hearts? Charismatic? Thoughtful? Hungry for knowledge? Sensitive? Humorous?
I have this sneaking suspicion that the ones who never make the cut as Witnesses are a mixture of all of the above - traits that could never flourish in the Witness community. Characteristics that betrayed the individual's sense of conformity to the stringent mold WT has everyone conform to. Forward-thinkers with compassion and a desire to genuinely learn more, such as Raymond Franz, were quickly rooted out and ostracized for being just so.
It almost appears to me that to be a Witness, one must be academically dishonest, disloyal to their natural instincts when it comes to love and mercy, unmotivated to do any research for themselves, easily offended by outside stimuli, judgmental toward others and callous to the plight of those in emotional turmoil around them.
I'm making a sweeping generalization here, but I would love to hear you weigh in on this based on your experience.
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Why is the approval of family so important?
by jwfacts inone of the reasons people remain pimo is fear of losing family.
those that are disfellowshipped and shunned regularly comment about how devastated that they have lost the approval of their parents.. when i respond to emails from people saying how difficult it is being estranged or looked down on by their parents, i would like to say that over time they will come to terms with it, except i not sure that people ever do.
i cannot shake that feeling either.
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
@pbrow That is some quantum sh*t right there. Damn! I actually cried two days ago to my father and asked how he could have brought me up as a Witness. Having been born in the 1930s and a Witness since the 50s - and an elder since the 60s - he was alive well into the "Great Apostasy" with Raymond Franz. Surely he had avenues to explore for himself what the truth about the truth was? And yet he turned a blind eye. I swore to him up and down that because of the knowledge I now have about the WTBTS, I simply do not have the RIGHT to indoctrinate my toddler into this group. That would be disingenuous and utterly cruel to tamper with my child's mental faculties in this way. -
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Why is the approval of family so important?
by jwfacts inone of the reasons people remain pimo is fear of losing family.
those that are disfellowshipped and shunned regularly comment about how devastated that they have lost the approval of their parents.. when i respond to emails from people saying how difficult it is being estranged or looked down on by their parents, i would like to say that over time they will come to terms with it, except i not sure that people ever do.
i cannot shake that feeling either.
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Wake Me Up Before You Jo-Ho
What does PIMO stand for? I keep seeing it pop up on discussion threads... Prisoner In My Opinion? I can't work it out.